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Posted 8M ago by @TexanExpat

🌺 🌵 🌞🌼 Is being told you're “overwatering” your beloved M...

🌺 🌵 🌞🌼 Is being told you're “overwatering” your beloved Monstera leading you astray? 🌿💧 🌧️💦 l 🕵️‍♂️🌱🔍🌿

Raise of hands for anyone who has felt empowered after being told that the apparent problems affecting your otherwise perky beloved Monstera, Mr Bigglesworth, looks the way it does because of “overwatering?” As if you had done something wrong. Show of hands? Anyone?

Raise your hands if after being told that Mr Bigglesworth had been overwatered, that you knew precisely how much water you should have witheld from your thirsty plant to have prevented a fungal infection? Anyone?? No???

Raise your hand if you could say with confidence that you know precisely how to differentiate the quantity of water that makes the difference between “underwatered” vs “sufficiently hydrated” vs “overwatered”. Anyone??? *cue the sounds of crickets*

I’m kidding of if I couldn’t possibly see the hands but I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that none of you raided your hands.

I would like to invite you all for a discussion on how the language we use to discuss identifying and treating fungal infections can lead us astray. I find that providing advice is more successful when it equips someone not only with an understanding of the immediate issue but also with the context sufficient to prevent a recurrence.

Recently, after a heavy rainstorm, I had an epiphany regarding the care of my Split-leaf philodendron in a large 20” plastic container. I wondered if watering it shortly before the rain would leave it susceptible to fungal infections, given the compounded moisture from both sources and the non-porous nature of the container. Fortunately, it remained unaffected, but it made me realize that the outcome relied on chance rather than accounting for this risk when initially potting the plant.

What I came to understand was how the composition of the substrate, considered alongside the type of container and other factors, all play a role in the incidence of fungal infections. I realized that I could safeguard against fungal pathogens through strategic considerations of the interplay of these factors.
To this end, I deem it prudent to abandon terms like "overwatering" and "underwatering" from my lexicon. These terms are imprecise at best and misleading at worst. If my philodendron had developed an infection from the rain, it would not have been because I "overwatered" it, but rather because too much moisture was trapped in the substrate, creating conditions ripe for fungal pathogens to proliferate.

Thus, using terms like "overwatering" and "underwatering" to conceptualize plant care can indeed oversimplify the complex dynamics of moisture management and substrate composition, potentially leading to misinterpretations and detrimental effects on plant health.

In the scenario described, where a plant receives proper watering but later develops a fungal infection due to excessive moisture in the substrate, attributing the issue solely to "overwatering" would indeed be a mischaracterization.

Instead, it is more accurate to recognize that the substrate became waterlogged, creating an environment conducive to fungal proliferation. This distinction highlights the importance of understanding the role of substrate composition in moisture management.

An optimized substrate composition, designed to provide adequate drainage, would mitigate the risk of waterlogging and fungal infections. By incorporating materials like perlite, coarse sand, or vermiculite into the substrate mix, water retention is balanced with proper drainage, preventing excess moisture buildup. This ensures that even in situations of intermittent rainfall or accidental overwatering, the substrate can effectively regulate moisture levels, reducing the likelihood of fungal infections.

Additionally, other factors beyond watering practices and substrate composition can contribute to substrate saturation and fungal infections. The type of container used, whether porous or nonporous, influences moisture evaporation and drainage. Containers with inadequate drainage holes or made from nonporous materials can exacerbate water retention issues, leading to waterlogged substrates. Moreover, factors such as exposure to direct sunlight, ventilation, and the presence of a top dressing can affect evaporation rates and substrate moisture levels, further influencing the risk of fungal infections.
By considering these nuanced factors and moving away from simplistic notions of "overwatering" or "underwatering," plant caregivers can adopt a more comprehensive approach to moisture management and substrate composition, ultimately promoting healthier plant growth and reducing the likelihood of fungal infections.
To break free from the pestilence of fungal pathogens and imprecise vocabulary, one must consider how to optimize the substrate.
The characteristics of an optimal substrate vary depending on the species of plant being grown, with the primary aim being to mimic the native conditions in which the plant naturally thrives. However, some general principles apply across different types of plants:
* Texture: Mimicking the natural texture of the plant's native habitat is essential. For most plants, achieving a balanced texture that allows for adequate aeration and drainage while retaining sufficient moisture is crucial. Incorporating a mixture of organic matter (such as compost or peat moss) and inorganic materials (such as perlite or vermiculite) can emulate the varied textures found in natural soils.
* Drainage: Native habitats often feature well-draining soils to prevent waterlogging, which can lead to root rot. Incorporating coarse materials like perlite, gravel, or sand into the substrate mimics the natural drainage characteristics of the plant's native environment.
* Moisture retention: Plants in their native habitats have adapted to specific moisture levels. Mimicking these conditions involves providing a substrate that retains moisture adequately without becoming waterlogged. Organic matter like peat moss or coconut coir can replicate the moisture retention properties of natural soils.
* Nutrient availability: The availability of nutrients in native soils varies depending on the ecosystem. Mimicking these conditions involves providing essential nutrients for plant growth through the addition of compost, aged manure, or commercial fertilizers tailored to the specific needs of the plant species.
* pH balance: Native soils often have a specific pH range that suits the plant species. Mimicking this pH balance involves adjusting the substrate's pH using amendments like lime or sulfur to match the plant's native conditions.
* Consistency: Native soils typically have a consistent texture and composition throughout the plant's habitat. Mimicking this consistency in the substrate ensures uniform water distribution and root growth.
* Sterility: While native soils may contain beneficial microorganisms, they are generally free from harmful pathogens and pests. Mimicking this aspect involves sterilizing the substrate before use to prevent the introduction of harmful organisms.
Specific plant species may have additional requirements or preferences for substrate composition based on their native habitats. By understanding and mimicking these native conditions, growers can create optimal growing environments that support healthy root development and overall plant growth, leading to thriving and resilient plants.
Examples:
* Succulents, native to arid regions, thrive in well-draining substrates that mimic their natural habitat. A blend of potting soil, coarse sand, and perlite in a ratio of 2:1:1 provides optimal conditions.
* Aroids, such as peace lilies and philodendrons, prefer consistently moist soils reminiscent of their tropical origins. Achieving this moisture retention requires a substrate composed of equal parts potting soil, peat moss, and perlite or vermiculite.
* Ferns, adapted to moist environments, necessitate substrates that retain moisture without becoming waterlogged. A suitable mix comprises potting soil, peat moss, and perlite in a ratio of 3:2:1.
* For houseplants in general, a balanced mix of potting soil, perlite, and organic matter, such as compost or coconut coir, in a ratio of 3:1:1 provides adequate drainage, aeration, and moisture retention.

I would love any insight y’all might have, whether you agree or disagree, as I find the opportunities to hear from such a community of plant lovers. And I think everyone benefits from such discourse, especially considering how fungus seems to be such a topic of repeated occurrence on here.

I plan on doing another such discussion of a proper watering technique as this is the other side of the same coin.
#PlantCare #GreenThumb #IndoorGardening #UrbanJungle #BotanicalBeauty #PlantLove #HealthyHabitat #LeafyLife #GrowTogether #optimizedsubstrate
#GregGang #CentralTexasGang #SanAntonioGregGang #GreggersSupportingGreggers #HappyPlants #PlantsMakePeopleHappy #PlantAddicts #plantdad
Thank you for helping me learn!!!!! I’m just starting out and want to turn my brown thumb green….
Wow! I’m curious to know how long it took you to write this? Thanks for the thought and time that went in to sharing your thoughts with us. I agree that plants need the type of soil that it is used to in their natural habitats. I will add that even a plant in well draining soil can become overwatered and suffer from a fungal infection if it’s been watered too frequently or there is too much soil in the pot for the roots to use up all the moisture that the soil receives when watering. It’s not natural for a plant to live in a pot. When it’s in its natural habitat, there is endless room for the water to move away from the plant, giving the roots a chance to breathe. Though, even in their natural habitat, they can suffer from the effects of overwatering. When I water my plants, I try my best to make sure they are in a pot size that isn’t too large with well draining soil and I drench them each time they dry out enough to warrant watering. I have found that if a plant is in too big of a pot, this method of watering does not work so well because the soil holds onto the moisture for too long leading to fungal issues. But, I don’t like the idea of measuring out water each time I water because I don’t think the plants are getting an adequate amount of moisture with that method and end up suffering from being underwatered. I agree with your points that pot size and material, soil structure, sunlight, ventilation, and watering habits all work together to help our plants to be the healthiest they can be.
Great discussion. I know you are/were a lawyer, but I read this to my husband who thought it was potentially an AI generated discussion 🤔 (I guess kudos to you for fooling him).

Most new plant people or someone with a first plant will be overwhelmed trying to read it. If it did not include all of the pre-discussion, and stuck to bullet points as you ended with, I think it could be a post referred to over and again.
I do think it's an awesome and very thorough assessment of factors affecting plants, and would get a new person thinking for sure about everything they don't know.
Most people do not put this much effort into research for the good of their plant(s).

You've done a nice job of summarizing a lot of information that really could help a lot of people to up their game & knowledge/care of plants should they choose to pay attention.

I think that we should make a new tag #plantcare101 and keep these really good posts and tidbits there. Then, new folks could be provided the guidance to "hey, click this link to see all of the really great plant care discussions."
@UltraKoreanfir that’s such a good idea! I love that tag!
This is really informative and goes along with something I was thinking about the other day, that many experienced plant owners are quick to diagnose an issue as due to overwatering, but don’t necessarily have all the information necessary to come to that conclusion. Sure, overwatering often IS the culprit, but sometimes it isn’t, and I try to make a conscious effort to really understand what the post is saying and the steps they have taken or not taken before labeling the issue like that. It can sometimes come off as unintentionally condescending and sometimes is said matter of fact, without instructions for what to do next, which is really what people are looking for when asking for help. Overwatering is just an example, of course, but it’s a good one and frequently diagnosed. But as you described so eloquently, sometimes, it’s not that simple. It could be interesting to come up with a sort of diagnostic flow chart for people to follow when having plant issues… but now I’m getting far ahead of myself. Thank you for writing this out, and giving us something to think about! Would love more as you decide to address different issues and as a side note, and sort of tying into @UltraKoreanfir’s #plantcare101 tag, you could write a great book series about plant care for beginners, those of intermediate skill, and seasoned plant owners with different levels and depths of information. Haha, not to tell you what to do at all, but I just think you’d write excellent books or even articles! Anyway, thank you for all the points to consider! 😊
@UltraKoreanfir @BabeVila thank you for the comments. I will address them in more substance later. The #PlantCare101 is an interesting idea, and I had thought about labeling the posting as such initially However, my hesitation stemmed from the fact that this isn’t a basic concept, I don’t believe. in fact, I’d like to think it’s my original idea but I’m sure it’s been talked about elsewhere yet I have yet to find any resource that talks about or frames the issue from the perspective of balancing the substrate with the watering technique I’m planning a post on proper water and technique because it’s the correlate; if you are methodical and think about the way that you bought your plant like a forearm and tennis, whereas doing one thing results in the ball going over that a slight change, it doesn’t. If you optimize the substrate and use a proper watering technique, it’ll significantly not eliminate the chances of excessive moisture in the soil. Also, vanish the terminology of over or under watering. I think the way that we frame concepts in the words with coin have an impact on not only the understanding of the issue, but the perpetuation of it, either good or bad. If you’re familiar with the book “The New Plant Parent” and it’s author’s social media accounts, Daryl Cheng, I have found the way that he frames the discussion, Euler, innovative. For example, when you think of plant care modern culture, as we know it from the Victorian era in those days, one would assess the light conditions by holding their hand up to the light and looking at the shadow cast, if it was well delineated in solid, it would be more towards the bright and light. If not, it would be more towards lower. This is clearly a low tech kind of way somewhat useful, probably to wetting your thumb and holding it in the air to get a sense of air direction. After getting familiar with Daryl’s perspective on one hand, it was ingenious that he changed the paradigm by using a light meter, a technology introduced since the Victorian era, to update the traditions, passed down from the Victorians, more scientific and precise way. On the other hand, I thought to myself. Well, I could’ve done that. Which is true, but kudos to him. as a result of his influence, when I think about care, I often think about whether the way or the mode of conceptualizing plant care has other areas where it can be innovated I’ve been focusing a lot on issues because they affect me a lot or they had postings I see on here, but my thesis is rather advanced concept I think not for a beginner per se, which is why I included all of the background information and context. This isn’t so much of perspective being gleaned from being well read; but rather, it’s more like a hypothesis. I didn’t want to post this as if it’s basic or conventional or even something that many people who are informed know about because in fact, I can’t say any of that. Perhaps somebody with actual expertise like culturalist is reading and can chime in, but I really wanted this to be more of a provoking exercise to test my ideas y’all are so kind for the feedback you and I greatly appreciate it. It takes a certain amount of confidence to post. Something one is so invested in when it’s an original thought because it can be too easy to be shot down from the sky like a hang glider over the pentagon. your comments underscore what a supportive and lovely community we have here on Gregg so thank you for the feedback and I will post more substantively when I think about it a little more
@TexanExpat, I'd call this a common sense concept, myself.

In my mind, "overwatered" encompasses all possible variables: substrate, soil amendments, pot material, number and size of drainage exits, amount or light and whether it is direct or indirect/real or manufactured, ambient temperature and humidity, material of the catch tray, way in which the wayering took place, additives in the water.... there's a macro view that must be taken into account when planting AND diagnosing.

A plant can be overwatered easily, but the question is "why"?

Real Life Example:
Symptom-- limp, dying peace lily
Cause-- overwatered
Mode of overwatering-- indirect light indoors with no drainage in a plastic pot that is 3 sizes too big for the plant with substrate that retains water
Answer-- several options: essentially, you could change any 2 of the modes and probably fix the problem

That all said, even the setup the plant was in (indirect light indoors with no drainage in a plastic pot that is 3 sizes too big for the plant with substrate that retains water) COULD work for the plant, if the correct amount of water is given. Hence, the overarching "overwatered".

Able to thrive? Possibly.

What did I do? The plant is now in 3 separate, smaller pots with extremely well-draining soil and lots of drainage exits, indirect light indoors.

*photo of the substrate when I removed the plant from the original pot it came in
@TexanExpat @bexplants @UltraKoreanfir @BabeVila thanks for your post as everyone before me has said you continue to teach me something new all the time. Thank you for being a part of this app without you I would of given up long time ago
@TexanExpat I think it takes great courage to trust us with your thoughts! I appreciate your perspective every time! This particular topic is an excellent one. I agree that it is most talked about in the community
@HeyLillie Ok now this is interesting and while i did not foresee the discussion going in this direction per se, your observations go to the heat of the reason I wanted y’all’s input.

So while “overwatered” to you conveyed various interrelated factors of which you are mindful of interrelated factors being self-evident, it was not self-evident to me. I used to buy miracle grow potting mix and all my plants were getting fungal diseases and it never dawned on me that perhaps even though I was watering no more than I should have (stopping when water came out the drainage hole) my misfeasance or negligent “overwatering” was not so much the issue as much as it was miracle grow retaining too much water.

Instead of being told the issue was merely a matter of “overwatering,” I wonder what difference using this language would have made on the health of my plants if I had been told this:

“The plant may have experienced root rot due to prolonged saturation of the substrate, possibly exacerbated by insufficient drainage or environmental factors.”

The two different articulations can lead to different levels of understanding because of their varying degrees of specificity and detail. The first articulation, simply stating "you overwatered your plant," leaves room for interpretation and may not fully convey the interrelatedness of various factors contributing to the plant's demise. Without further explanation, the listener may not fully grasp the role of factors such as substrate composition or environmental conditions—even though another listener very well may be mindful of the various factors.

On the other hand, the second articulation provides more context and detail, mentioning factors like prolonged substrate saturation, insufficient drainage, and environmental conditions. This more comprehensive explanation helps listeners understand the complex interplay of these factors and their impact on plant health. By explicitly mentioning these factors, the second articulation reduces ambiguity and leaves less room for misinterpretation.

While the latter articulation doesn't completely preclude divergences in understanding, it significantly reduces the likelihood of misunderstandings by providing a clearer and more detailed explanation of the situation. However, individual interpretation and understanding may still vary based on factors such as prior knowledge and experience with plant care. As to it being plant care 101, if the nomenclature eschewed what to me are imprecise worlds like “ overwatering” and instead used the language that takes substrate composition, environmental factors in the temporal element and consideration at the outset. This concept would be a 101 thing for sure. However, when the interrelatedness of the various factors are not conceptually, introduced at the outset of a discussion on what may have caused your planet to develop root rot or fungal diseases. It is a much deeper dive to go on, and explain how various factors are interrelated as I have been responding to one fungal post after another, my understanding of the degree of these interrelated factors and how I choose to articulate my responses has evolved over the last couple years on Greg. I guess I learned the hard way. lol @HeyLillie

And so it was my original thesis that the language we use may be serving us wrong. Or maybe I’m the only one lol. I have my Rainman moments lol.

Nonetheless, i think there is a lot of merit to advocating for a reevaluation of traditional plant care terminology as sensible

While terms like "overwatering" are widely used, they lack the precision needed for effective communication. By embracing clearer language that considers the various factors influencing plant health, enthusiasts can better understand and address issues. This shift promotes education and empowerment, helping us #plantpeople make informed decisions and prevent problems. Overall, prioritizing clarity and precision in plant care discussions benefits both plants and their caregivers.

Does anyone have any thoughts on other examples of being underserved by traditional nomenclature and phraseology. I for one, surely have struggled with “bright, indirect light” and especially “low light”. After seeing how Daryl Cheng on instagram @ houseplantjournal uses a light meter to evaluate how bright indirect light for one plant is not enough for another plant that is also a “bright indirect” light kinda plant.

Follow the link below and I think Daryl does a good job of taking a deeper dive on this issue https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cv-DCDmthtI/?igsh=amJuN2NybHoza
@HeyLillie @BabeVila @bexplants @UltraKoreanfir @Philolover @SublimeCorrea @FitBrowallia thank all of you for adding to this discussion I know there are a couple of loose ends with specific questions I am going to get back to you. I just need to put my phone down now because this last response took forever lol.
🙋‍♀️ The term overwatering really refers to the plant having too much water in its soil for too long a period of time. Most of the time, it is due to *too frequent* watering. My hand was raised as I used to be a “too frequent waterer”. Kill them with kindness.
This helped me understand lighting
My sister just recently decided to buy her first plant babies and I was over at her house when she was repotting them. I was talking about each plant and its need based on where they originated. And I was telling her some of these exact thoughts! Thank you for confirming a few things I had bouncing around my noggin. I agree with you. I think substrate knowledge is essential to helping these guys grow. And the more I interact with my plants the more I see the need for this understanding! I love the hashtag, so I can find this later!
@TexanExpat I just followed Daryl on instagram, thank you! And I for one very much agree that the term “overwatering” is an oversimplification and especially for people who are very new to plants, it wouldn’t necessarily occur to them that their soil had anything to do with it, or their container, etc. like you said. I also have a very hard time myself right now figuring out the light needs of my plants. It’s pretty much trial and for me. Ha
@Hypsie THANK YOU! I need this! 💚😊
Please don't get me wrong... I'm not advocating for the term "overwatering"! I'm not disagreeing with you, at all. "Overwatering" may be the overarching cause of problems, but I believe in educating one another and critical thinking.

I am a voracious learner, so when I started adding plants to my home, I read a lot and watched a ton of videos on youtube. Call me an informed consumer and/or a lifelong learner, I guess. Lol.

I try to look at everything I do from both a macro and micro view: a watch is made of a hundred parts, but it is still a watch. Each part has to function properly for the watch to run. That's kind of my approach to most things.
@Hypsie yes that helped me too. I started out with many of my plants on a large covered balcony we have and it was had just come back after 20 years away from south Texas—- last year we had over 72 days above 100 degrees. I was concerned about them getting dehydrated and despite the heat I was still overwatering !
@HeyLillie I didn’t think you were disagreeing with me but it would have been okay if you did. I think you have seen enough of me on here to get a sense that I’m a cerebral person and I think a lot about these things. As I sit here and contemplate why heating these terms grates me so much it’s dawning on me that A) I was an English literature major in college; B) I was a trial lawyer and filed briefings all the time. If I had used a term like “overwatering” instead of the more precise articulation, I would not have had good enough grades to get into law school and as a lawyer it could been malpractice if my case got thrown out of court for lack specificity. I’m not in those worlds anymore but I think Daryl Cheng’s example of applying the precision of his engineers mind allows in how he teaches plant care has helped a lot of people get a better grasp on plant care than the less precise resources. But thank you for outting so much consideration into this topic. I personally will eschew those words unless I’m in a rush lol